Barks, Bites & Behaviour
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Barks, Bites & Behaviour
Nutrition and the link between behaviour
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In this episode, we talk to Jess a Canine Behaviourist and Nutrition expert about the importance of why a healthy balance nutrition is so essential to behaviour, along side Jess giving her top 5 tips when it comes to looking for foods, and her top 3 products for chewing.
Jess has an online Nutrition shop, follow the link below to check it out.
https://followmyleadnutrition.co.uk/
ww.puppyanddogtraining.co.uk
https://www.skool.com/puppy-dog-training-uk-7950/about?ref=e3c1e03cdf7b4dbbb165977e2b61d551
Hi everyone, um, welcome to our latest edition of Barks, Bites and Behaviors with myself James. Today I am joined by the wonderful Jess. Um, Jess, we've known one another now for 2019, seven years. Yeah, long time. It's crazy, isn't it? So some people will listen to other podcasts what I've done, um, and they will know that I've mentioned the IMDT four dayer, and that's where me and you met.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. So what a four days.
SPEAKER_00That was incredible, wasn't it? Absolutely. Loved it. Uh so yeah, it just proves that that course. I don't think I've been on another course where people do stay friends for as long as as long as everyone has done. And I was had Gary on the other week with his husky story and everything like that. Um, Cheryl from Cornwall. So it's it's great. It is great. But um, yeah, thank you for taking the time to come on. I know how busy you are. You are really, really busy all the time. So really appreciate it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's a pleasure. No, it's a pleasure. Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_00You're very welcome. Um, Jess, just give us a little bit of a background to you. How how and why dog training really? What what was it about it?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah, so I think, you know, I think actually looking back on my life, I think when I was when I was a kid, I was always absolutely obsessed with all animals. Absolutely obsessed. Um happiest, you know, eating my lunch in the garden amongst the wood lice and uh and uh making friends with squirrels and things like that. So um I was always completely obsessed with animals, and I think really at 16 I sort of knew what I wanted to do, but I kind of got funnelled into the you know uni thing. Um, and you kind of, you know, you do your GCSE G ray levels, then you do the next thing, and then you do the next, and it just kind of I ended up, you know, um being funnelled down that kind of path uh studying psychology. Um so animals of a slightly different sort. Um, and ended up working in academia, thought that that was what I wanted to do, um, and and kind of yeah, the the career I was going to choose. And uh the work-life balance just didn't, you know, it wasn't for me. It's a it's a really competitive world, and it lots of people really thrive in academia, but it just didn't suit me. Um so then I changed and I went into industry and started working in market research and did that for a little while. Um, but I just couldn't tolerate being in an office all day, uh, every day, really. And I sort of had a bit of an epiphany um one one day, and I was just like, hold on, I could work with dogs. Um, and I don't know how it had sort of fallen out of my head that that was a possibility. Um, so I quit my job and started working as a dog walker um while I trained as a trainer. Um and then I was got qualified as a trainer, started working as a trainer, and then after a year I started my journey to be qualified as a behaviourist um with the IMDT, which was fab fabulous. Um, and and then just most recently I've I've done some nutrition training, so added another kind of element, um, and and here we are.
SPEAKER_00Excellent. So, how long have you been following my lead training and behaviour? When did your business start? Was that pre-2019 or after you'd done your four day?
SPEAKER_01It was after, yeah. So I I set up in actually right in the middle of lockdown in July 2020. Um, because I mean it might it may seem uh unusual, but everyone and their mum got a dog um in in July 2020. And also we we uh we had personally just got um a puppy pre-lockdown, um, but so I'd just been through the puppy stage with her.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I think we've lost Jess for a second.
SPEAKER_01Am I back?
SPEAKER_00Oh, you're back, Jess. Yeah, you're back. We've got that. That's alright. Um so Jess, I think yeah, if you can just run that, you got your puppy. I think we lost you a bit there, and we'll we'll catch up with that a bit later. Um but you got your puppy, so you went through the puppy stage, you started in July 2020.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And then yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. So started right in the middle of lockdown. We got a puppy just before lockdown started, so I just sort of experienced all of the puppy struggles and trainings and stages in it, and it just felt like the right time. Um, so yeah, almost six years now.
SPEAKER_00Amazing, amazing. And then obviously, you you moved over to the behaviourist thing as well, because I think there's there's quite a lot of conversation that always happens about is someone a trainer, is someone a behaviourist, what gives them the right to name themselves a behaviorist? And I mean, ultimately, anyone could class themselves as behaviourist. We know that we know that from the dog world, it's it's unregulated. But you did the level five, is that yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so absolutely. So it it's slightly slightly terrifying that um anyone could could say they're a trainer or behaviorist, but um that is that is the world as is at the moment. Yeah, um, but I definitely didn't didn't want to do that. Um, and I also wanted to gain you know the more the more in-depth knowledge and and training to allow me to confidently operate as a behaviorist, as well as having the you know, the the ability to have the title according to the the IMDT.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um so yeah, I did the level five, um, which was fantastic and I loved it. Um, and as part of that, you have to do case studies of of you know cases you're working on, and um yeah, it was it was brilliant. But yeah, there is a lot of sort of confusion over what counts as training and what counts as behaviour. Um, and I think the way I tend to distinguish it for people is that if we're if we're teaching the dog how to do something, it's it's training. Uh and if we're teaching the dog or or if we're working with the dog about how they feel about something, it's behaviour. Um, that tends to kind of separate the two.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. So it's that again, younger dogs or even older dogs, because again, we can teach our older dogs new things what we're looking to do. But behaviourism is more of that my dog's got this problem where it will shout and shout and shout, and then we get to the stage of adjusting the behaviour modification plan. So it's yeah, it's nice that we've got both both brackets of the business there. That's really good. Really good.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely, and it's it's brilliant. I love to intersing a kind of a heavy reactivity session with a brand new puppy training because it's just different, and it's I love them both for different reasons.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I think it's again sometimes I've had clients who I've got to know really, really well, and they will say to me, Oh, your job, it must be great because all you do all day is just play with dogs. And when you go into the depths and things like that, it's like I've got some dogs that I've worked with where I haven't been able to get close to them for three or four hours. You know, you've had to do three or four sessions before you've built up a trust in this dog. It's not because they want to bite you, kill you, eat you, whatever it is. It's you know, I've I've had one just recently. Um, dog's coming over from Europe, an amazing family have taken this dog on, and they're doing absolutely everything right. But this dog is so nervous and so quiet. And I actually saw her yesterday, yeah, and that was the seventh hour that I would have seen her, and she finally approached me and put her pause onto my foot, and it was just I still couldn't do the hands-on, still couldn't get there, but that's fine. No, just that, yeah, we're building that trust, and that that feeling is just amazing. So it's not all about fluffy covers, is it?
SPEAKER_01It's not at all. No, there is there is nothing quite like a dog's sort of learning to trust, but you're so right, it's you have to go at the dog's pace. Um, and it there is no kind of there's no timeline because it's how they feel. It's like therapy for them, it's how they feel. Um, there are no kind of quick fixes, unfortunately. Um, yeah. If if you're mindful of the dog in in the picture, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00I I know I know exactly what we mean by that, yeah, for sure. For sure. So you've been running um goodness, yeah, like since 2020. When did nutrition start for you? Obviously, quite recently. It's it's it's a new thing, but tell me about what was it about the nutrition side that made you want to jump over?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I think um it's always been a bit of a passion of mine um for feeding my own dogs. Um so I've always wanted to give them the best food um that I could, and and you know, to to you know, help them be as healthy as they possibly could. Um and so I kind of did a lot of research into what I should feed my dogs. Um and through through learning about what I should feed them, I kind of became fascinated actually with the impact of nutrition um on you know obviously health, but also on behaviour and on well-being and how a dog feels and and how able they are to relax and everything like that. And and you know, I kind of became quite alarmed at the at the number of uh substandard offerings, um, I think for treats and and foods for dogs and a lot of misinformation. Um, and I found it really scary that actually there there was this kind of conflicting advice. Um and I also found that I was I was then recommending owners to go and purchase specific things, and I was kind of like, I'm missing a trick here. So I kind of wanted wanted the know-how and the and the kind of expertise to advise clients on on feeding their dogs, whatever choice of food that's type that may be, whether they want to feed dry or wet or raw or whatever, um, the way to choose the best for their dog and and the impacts of that and the potential impacts of that, of of changing that. Um, but also wanted to be able to offer um then products that would support that. So, you know, now I can say we don't really want to be using treats filled with sugar and colourings and things like that because it's just not it's just not conducive to learning, it's not gonna do anything great for your dog's health. And you know what? We all have we all have a treat every now and then, and it's absolutely fine if your dog has, you know, occasional, you know, junk treats. That's you know, we all have junk food from time to time, but but you know, if if the bulk of their their training is coming from really nutritious whole foods, it's just gonna help them learn and also to help them feel as good as they can.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, and I think it's it's important for um our listeners to understand that when they are looking at food and they do need to speak to people, A, don't be afraid to speak to people about it. There are some amazing nutritionists out there. Um B, it's not always going to be about a price point. You know, we're not gonna say, as trainers, behaviourists, nutritionists, we're not gonna say, right, well, you must be spending 80 pounds on a 12 kilo pack of kibble. Because there is a massive chance that that may not be the best food for your dog. Um completely.
SPEAKER_01It's you know, the often the the the most expensive foods are the big name brands. Um you're often it's a bit like designer clothes, you're paying for a label a little bit. Um, and yeah, you're absolutely right. I always just encourage clients to look at the back of the packet, um, read the ingredients. That's that's what you should judge it based on. Um, and there are, you know, there are really, really good, really affordable options for feeding your dog. Um, it isn't it isn't that you need to take out a mortgage to to fill their bowl at all. Um but but yeah, it's just about really prioritizing those whole foods as in as natural a form as as you can.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And you touched upon there, Jess, like the ingredients which are really, really key as well. Uh, it's also looking at the nutritional value as well, so the fat content, protein, everything like that. What how can you explain that easily to clients? Is there just some kind of guidance that you could give to say we need to look at this, this, this, this, and this when you're when you're looking at the back of the packet? What are your five top takeaways for clients to look at?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I would say that number one would be that you want the first ingredient of the food to be a named protein source. Yeah. So you want it to not be poultry, um, you want it to be chicken or turkey or duck or you know, whatever, whatever the protein is, fish. Um, you want it to be a named protein source, and you want that to be a relatively high percentage. So they list the ingredients in order of uh volume that they take up in the recipe. So you want that first ingredient to be a named protein source. Ideally, we want it to be fresh as well. Um, so you might often see on packages um meat meal, um, and it's it's okay. It's it's you know, it's it's still good nutrition, but ideally, if we're going for the gold standard, we we want the food to be made from fresh. Um I would say that you want to look for um foods that aren't excessively high in fat. So some lower quality foods, in order to be made palatable, they coat them in fat, basically, to make them taste nice. Um, so we want to be looking that there's not an excessive fat content um in the food. And that will vary for individual dogs, um, you know, the fat content they should have. So often puppies have a higher fat diet, sometimes older dogs need a little bit more fat uh as they as they enter their soil ears um just to support their systems. But we also want to look at the source of the fat. So we really want to look at our omegas. Um, so things like oily fish are amazing for dogs for their for their joints, for their eyes, for their coats. Um so we want to be looking for those real natural sources of of fats. We don't need to be artificially kind of adding um produced fats to dog's diets. That's that's kind of a long way from real food. Um I would say number three, am I number three or number four? I don't know.
SPEAKER_00So we've got ingredients, we've got natural fats. Let's go three, yeah. Okay, let's go number three.
SPEAKER_01So I'd say number three is that we want the food to be as as minimally processed as we can from real food to what we're putting in our dog's bowl. So dog food undergoes various treatments to come in the form that we kind of receive it to feed our dog. So sometimes it's uh treated under high pressure, uh, that's called cold pressed. Sometimes it's treated, uh it's it's also kind of heated uh to really high temperatures, that's called uh extrusion, um, where they heat it and pressurize it. Um, and all of those processes make it slightly less digestible for the dog. Um now it's not that it's not okay to feed dry food, that's not the case at all. It absolutely is, but it's just important to be mindful the more processing a food has undergone, just like for us, the less available the nutrients are going to be to your dog. So often people will feed feed a dry food that's perhaps not the best quality, and they find their dog is pooing a lot.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And if you especially with some of these really expensive foods, that's all just waste. That's going straight through them. So, you know, you're feeding a big bowl full of this food, and actually a lot of what you're paying for ends up you're picking it up again at the end. Um which is, I mean, one, the dog's not able to access that nutrition, but two, it's it's a big waste of money. Um and frankly, who wants to pick up more poop?
SPEAKER_00Um so yeah, you're almost at that point, it's like you you get your 12 kilo bag, and at times you think just chug it in the bin. Because if it's so bag, yeah, it's so quick that it goes through your dog and nothing holds into your dog at all. Yeah, it is it's just such a quick process, isn't it?
SPEAKER_01100%. So I think number four would be if your dog has a specific dietary uh requirement like weight loss or weight gain, I wouldn't go for a food designed for that. So I would go for a really good standard kind of a really good solid base of a food. And if they need to lose weight, feed them less of it. If they need to gain weight, feed them a bit more of it. There's no need to be feeding them insoluble fibers um at a great volume. There's no need to be making their food indigestible uh for for the sake of weight loss. Now, we want our dog to feel satiated and full, but add some veggies, you know, add some bulk in a natural way. Um put their food in a slow feeder, it's gonna slow down how quickly they eat, they're gonna feel more satisfied from it. Um, and actually, if we're feeding them at an appropriate level for slow weight loss, they're not gonna be starving hungry. Um, they might be used to eating a bigger volume, but that's kind of how weight loss works, right? We have to just gently reduce it. So I would I would always advise to steer away from those foods with a purpose because it tends to mean there's something artificially been kind of added or taken away from the food as a whole food. Um, and the last one, these have gone on gone gone on a bit, sorry. Um the last one I would say is breed-specific foods are a bit of a myth. Um so often I see, you know, it's it's like rottweiler food or labrador food or chihuahua food. And there certainly is a distinction, especially in dry foods, small breed and large breed, but that distinction is usually purely the kibble size, um, so the size of the biscuit, uh, and sometimes larger breed food has a bit more joint uh care in it. Yeah, but I would avoid the trap of thinking you have to feed this food because it says your dogs breed on it. Um there are ways that we can adjust the food to be appropriate for their breed, but that isn't usually by buying a food with their breed on the packet. Um, often they are exactly the same as the next one. Um, and you pay a real premium for it. So, yeah, that's that would be my top five. Excellent-winded top five.
SPEAKER_00No, that's brilliant, and I think as well, Jess, what that touches upon from all aspects of dog life is that it's really, really common that you know, trainers and behaviourists like trainers and behaviourists like ourselves will hear that constant, oh, you've got a dash hound, it will bark, it's natural, all Daxis bark. Then you've got you know, a Labrador, all Labradors eat quickly. Um, and I think it's really key to say that alongside that food where it's not a one size fits all, we can't breed specific food because every single dog's an individual. That is exactly the same as training and behaviour. You know, we can't say you've got a Labrador, we can get it to loosely walk in ten weeks and job done. Because every single dog is so different. Um, yeah, and there was one that I always think back to, and it was um on the Pete Wicks uh Dogs Trust show, and they've got an amazing behaviorist there, and they were talking about one of the dogs there, and it took this behaviourist a year to muzzle train this dog because the dog needed so much time and space and understanding, and that doesn't make someone a bad behaviourist, that makes them an absolutely incredible behaviourist that they've taken the time to understand. Do you know what? This dog just isn't ready for the next step. And if we push too hard, we're gonna rewind that situation. We're gonna take that dog so far backwards that that year becomes two years, two and a half years.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's undoing the damage, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. So we've we've got to go slow. We always know we've got to go slow with how. We're building behaviour, but also thinking about that nutrition side of things as well. It isn't just a case, like we've said, don't go straight into the pet shop and go, oh, 80 quid for 12 kilos. That must be the creme de la crack. That must be amazing. You need to have a look at the box there. Um, I think as well, just that thought process of don't just think that you're paying for the food itself, because you have got brand names out there, which again we know what kind of world we live in, everything's profit-driven, so they will inflate that. Um, they've got to take into consideration the cost to process everything, so the electric, the water, the business rates, everything that feeds into their overall setup has got to be priced accordingly into that food. So it's not necessarily that the quality of that food is absolutely incredible, it could just be they have a massive storage unit, what they need to gain a little bit more for electric, a little bit more for heating, keep their staff happy, and that feeds into your food.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00So I think, guys, just take a step back when you're thinking about food. Um, have a look at what that packet is, you know. If we go to a restaurant or something like that and we order a takeaway or a sit-in meal, we'll study those ingredients because I know if I go for a certain dish and it's got let's say I go for a dish which has got coriander mixed in with rice, I'm like, no, no, no one puts coriander in my rice, it's not it's not for me. And I think we need to look at that in the same format for your dogs as well, and really get them understanding.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's like when you go to the supermarket and you know, you want to buy the the kind of quality ingredients to feed yourself. It's it's it's no different than than what we should do for our dogs. And you know, as I said, we all have we all have a bit of a treat now and then, and then that's absolutely fine. Um, but it's we we really want to prioritize natural whole foods for the bulk of their diet um as much as we can, and that's that's just gonna set them up to be healthy for a for a long time, but also to be able to learn, to feel settled in their behaviour, and just you know, feel as well as they can and as as kind of happy as they can. Um it's it's all-encompassing. We know the gut brain link is is just immense. Um, it's so powerful. It's so there's so much research coming out now still about it and and the huge impact of the the gut microbiome on emotion and the brain and and all of this as you know, there's stacks of research in people, there's research coming out in dogs, and it is absolutely fascinating. But if you think what fuel are we putting into that microbiome, and and if it's not right for the dog, then you know, most of the serotonin is produced in the gut. And you know, what what are we gonna what are we gonna see if we're not giving that that kind of machine the right the right fuel to work with?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that's that's such a critical point that that we look at that. I guess another critical point, um something that we uh again, we we hear these conversations, we get these phone calls all the time. Not just in puppies, but let's let's just dogs across, whether we've got a three-month-old dog or an eight-year-old, nine-year-old, ten-year-old. My dog keeps chewing. They're chewing my furniture, they're chewing this, they're chewing that. I know how important it is, Jess. Um, tell our listeners about natural chews. Giving your dog a chewing outlet.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. So I think a lot of a lot there's a lot of information that chewing is a bad behaviour, or is a puppy behaviour to grow out of or is a bad behaviour to correct. And absolutely we don't we don't want them chewing your dining table. No, that's that is an unwanted behaviour, granted. But chewing itself is a really, really natural dog behaviour, and actually it's essential for their well-being. It releases a ton of endorphins, it's really, really important for them as a way to relax, uh, de-stress, settle their nervous system, aside from all the benefits for their dental health. Um, so it's incredible uh for cleaning, keeping their teeth clean. Um you know, and and natural shoes are the best way to offer that outlet for your dog. So we're thinking all the bits of animals that make people go, oh so, you know, the ears, the the tails, the the you know, the skin that, you know, otherwise we'd probably get just get chucked in a landfill. Um, and and all those bits actually offer really, really great opportunities and options for a really calming kind of activity for your dog that's gonna feed that natural outlet. And through scratching that itch, we're gonna, believe it or not, reduce the chance that they're gonna chew your dining table because they they're getting that need met. But also by prioritizing natural, wholesome chews for them. One, we're not adding anything nasty um to their diet that we've worked so hard to be good to be giving them a good thing. We're keeping their teeth clean, and we're actually adding some really good sources of of other nutrients. So collagen, really good sources of natural fats. Um, you know, if we if we think about fish skin chews, they're great for omegas. Um, and we get you know the the opportunity to offer these additional nutrients to our dog as well as meeting that natural urge, helping our dogs relax, saving our dining table. What's not a love? Um and and it's really it's also I think it's just really nice for our dog to experience a different kind of textures and different flavours. And I I don't know if it's just me, maybe, maybe it's just me, but I love when I have something new for my dogs to try. Um, and I'm like, I really want to see if they like this, what they make of it. Um, and because you know, when we get like a food we've never tried before, it's exciting. You're like, oh, what's it gonna be like? Am I gonna like it? Am I not? Um, and I I think you know that's a really nice that's a really nice thing for our dogs as well. Um, and you know, you might find some things that they they don't really love it, they're kind of hit or miss with it, and then you find something that they really love. Um, and it's I I I personally find that such a wonderful experience um to see them exploring it. Um and it's great mental stimulation for them. One, the chewing, obviously, of as we've mentioned, but new experiences, exploring things in a new way for our dogs is is just amazing for their for their minds. So opening them up to those new experiences, different textures, flavours, all of that. There's a whole world of enrichment we can offer them, as well as hitting those health and and dental requirements and and that chewing need.
SPEAKER_00And that's yeah, I think it's one thing that really stuck out to me from from what you've just been saying there, Jess, about the the chewing, it is a behaviour your dog needs to do. It is it's not your dog being a pain in the backside, it's not your dog being stubborn, defiant, you know, trying to be the alpha and you know, all the rubbish that we constantly hear at times from people. When your dog has got an emotional need, if we don't fulfil it ourselves, and not just not just diet-wise, behaviour wise as well, yeah. If we don't look to fulfil it in part of their daily life, they're gonna go self-employed.
unknownYep.
SPEAKER_00And when you have got a self-employed dog, there is nothing worse. It's it's horrible.
SPEAKER_01It is unlikely that they will choose uh choose an outlet that we are okay with. Um I mean you might be lucky, but um uh yeah, and it's absolutely it's these things are a non-negotiable in a dog's life, and and they their need for it might not come out in ways we would think. So you might not, a dog that's not having a chewing need met, they might not chew your dining table, but they might not be able to settle, or they might excessively bark, or you know, they might do kind of um compulsive behaviours like spinning a lot or or ripping up their beds, or you know, anything, anything that's kind of an outlet for that emotion um because they're not having that need met. So it's not always as straightforward as, oh, well, they're chewing the table, so they need to chew. It's uh we need to look almost preemptively at what are the natural dog behaviours and what where is my dog got gaps and how can I support those. Um, and you know, some dogs are stronger chewers than others, some dogs have a greater need to chew than others. That's absolutely again, all dogs are individual, but it's it's rare that there's a dog that doesn't receive some satisfaction from such an actual behaviour.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. So just leading into that, because again, I know with your nutrition business, and I'll put links in for your nutrition business, of course. Um top three, top three chews that you have available for our clients. What do you sell? Talk to me about your favourites. Bang three out for me straight away, Jess. Let's go.
SPEAKER_01Okay, so I would say that my, I guess my favourite slash what's the best sellers. Um, so I'll try and I'll try and do a mix for the three. Oh. Um, so I really, really think that hairy chews are great. Um, I think that they're really, really healthy for our dogs. They're also a completely new sensory experience than or a completely different sensory experience than hairless chews. So I'm gonna go for an humble one hairy cow ear. Okay. It's it's quite a cow is quite accessible because they're not particularly high in fat. So pig's ears are the classic, but pig's ears are quite rich, they're quite high in fat. So for young dogs or dogs with a bit more of a sensitive um stomach, sometimes pig's ears are a little bit too rich, um, a little bit too fatty. And also for dogs that are uh needing to lose some weight, um, again, they're they're just that little bit more uh calorific. Whereas cow's ears tend to be less fatty, so they're a little bit easier on the tummy. Um you can get hairless cow ears, which are also great, but um, I find if your dog likes a hairy chew, it's it's a really good um kind of gut, gut kind of cleaning thing. It's really, really great for their teeth. Um, so that you can imagine like a toothbrush, right? You're chewing on something hairy. It's it's akin to us brushing our teeth. So something with hair is really good for them. And and also you can get quite a range of sizes. Um, so you can get pieces of cow ear, but but you can also get whole cow's ear, and if you picture a cow, they've got quite big ears. So it's it's a good versatile chew for lots of different sizes and and ages of dog, I would say, while not being super, super hard. Um, so that'd be number one. Number two, I would say probably is a fish skin chew. So either a fish finger or a fish skin braid, um, and and there are various sizes of those as well. Um, and it really depends on the texture your dog prefers. So fish fingers are crunchy, braids are more chewy. Um, but purely for the health benefits, um, they are so, so good for your dog. Um, there is omegas in them, there's vitamins they could they can't get from anything else, there's nutrients that they can't get from meat that they get from fish. Um, and also just it's a completely different kind of eating experience for them to eat fish versus to eat meat. So I really, I really kind of love uh introducing a dog to fish and think fish skin cheese are fabulous. Um, and before anyone asks, the braids are pressed raw, so they don't actually smell too bad. Um, the fingers smell terrible. Um and and then the last one I would say probably one that's super popular is our camel skin rolls. Um and they are really popular because they last so long. So of all the chews, uh of all the skins available, camel is the toughest, basically. Um, so it that is a chew if you've got a really strong chewer, um, or or you don't, and you want a chew to last for several weeks. But if you've got a really strong chewer, I mean I've got a large dog, she's got very strong jaws, and a camel chew will last her for a good couple of hours. Um, so that they're my top three, I would say, is a bit of a bit of a range for different reasons, but but certainly the camel skin rolls and sticks are super popular uh as a real long lasting, long-lasting option.
SPEAKER_00Perfect. Jess, that's been brilliant. I think we've given our listeners a lot of information there. Um something different as well, because again, I think a lot of people come on and talk behaviour and behavior modification. So I think it's nice to have that nutrition. Um, I did a podcast a little while back, and we talked pain and the relation between pain and behaviour. So again, just having that knowledge of nutrition and behaviour. There's so many things that we have to consider about what your dog is doing. Um, and I think if you are listening to this and you are, you know, you are looking to work with a trainer, you are looking to work with a behaviourist, when we throw out those questions of what do you feed your dog, how do you feed your dog, what times a day do you feed your dog, you know, that's not us being really nosy. Genuinely, guys, there is a massive reason why we want to know literally 24 hours in the life of your dog, but we want to know it minute by minute. We're not we're not trying to deep dive into your personal information. Everything that we ask has an effect on how your dog will behave and what we can do to help you move forward with that training and behaviour modification. So it's been absolutely great. Um, so good to catch up. So good to catch up. I know it's as I say, we know it's you know seven years, but it's kind of like probably three times a year, we briefly touch bases life is just absolute bonkers. Um yeah, no, it's it's been really, really lovely, and thank you again for taking the time because as I say, I know you've got you've got a busy Monday ahead.
SPEAKER_01So no, it's my pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. And and you know, just one final thing I would say is that when your trainer asks you or your behaviourist asks you what you feed, there's no judgment. Um you know, us suggesting alternatives, that's not judgment. Um, so that's that's my parting bit of wisdom. Um, we just want we just want to help. Um, and yeah, but it's been fantastic, so good to catch up. So thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_00You're very welcome, you're very welcome. Um, guys, that's it for this episode of Bart Bites and Behaviour. Thank you so much again to Jess. Uh, thanks for tuning in, thanks for listening. Whatever platform you're listening on, whether it's Spotify, Apple, if you're on our YouTube channel, please guys hit the like and subscribe button. Share the love of what we're trying to talk about, get this message out to as many of your friends and family as you possibly can. And we will be back soon for another new recording. Have a wonderful day, everyone. Take care.